#018: Unpacking Jordan Peterson (feat. Tylor Lovins)

July 17, 2018

On this episode, I am joined by Tylor Lovins to discuss the work of Jordan B. Peterson, the controversial clinical psychologist who has in the last two years become something of an academic rockstar. Our discussion mainly focuses on Peterson’s theological and philosophical claims as we try to unpack the complicated and often controversial ideas and concepts Peterson presents in his writings and online lectures and interviews. I have many criticisms of Peterson’s worldview in general, as well as many of his specific ideas and claims, but what I’m primarily interested in doing in this episode is trying to understand Peterson’s ideas and claims both on their own merits and in the context of Peterson’s wider thought so that those of us who are skeptical of his ideas can be in an informed position from which to critique his worldview without strawmanning or misrepresenting him.

My guest Tylor Lovins studied philosophy at Anderson University in Indiana and is one of the founders and contributors to ReasonRevolution.org, where he has written several articles having to do with philosophy, humanism, and the place of religion and theology within those domains. According to his bio on the website, Tylor “has been working on a theory of theological language that will express the meanings of religious statements to secular people.” 

Note: If you are or become a patron, you get access to an additional 20 minutes of content for this episode that I’ve cut out of this wide release version. If you want to subject yourself to the torture of hearing me, Nathan Dickey, talk on and on for 20 minutes by myself overanalyzing some of the issues my guest and I covered, then please consider becoming a patron for as little as $1 per month. You can find me at http://www.patreon.com/aleapofdoubt

Links:

Tylor Lovins, “Why Tell the Truth: On the Curious Notions of Jordan B. Peterson,” https://reasonrevolution.org/introduction-to-jordan-peterson/

Tylor Lovins, “My Disappointment with the Matt Dillahunty and Jordan Peterson Discussion,” https://reasonrevolution.org/my-disappointment-with-the-matt-dillahunty-and-jordan-peterson-discussion/

The opening Jordan Peterson clip is taken from this lecture: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6V1eMvGGcXQ

The Sam Harris/Jordan Peterson discussion on truth: https://samharris.org/podcasts/what-is-true/ 

The Matt Dillahunty/Jordan Peterson discussion: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmH7JUeVQb8

Nathan’s discussion about cultural narratives with Dr. Valerie Tarico on A Leap of Doubt Ep. #014: https://aleapofdoubt.podbean.com/e/014-cultural-narratives-political-tribes-humanity%E2%80%99s-death-star-feat-dr-valerie-tarico/ 

 

Join the official discussion group of this podcast at www.facebook.com/groups/aleapofdoubt.  

Consider supporting me Patreon if you enjoy the show: http://www.patreon.com/aleapofdoubt. Thanks to Jeff Prebeg, Jeanne Ikerd, Torsten Pihl, Chris Watson, and Kim Bojkovsky for being my patrons!

Follow me on Twitter at https://twitter.com/TheNatheist

The opening clip is an excerpt from the audiobook “God is Not Great” by Christopher Hitchens, courtesy of Hachette Audio. Text Copyright 2007 by Christopher Hitchens. Audio production copyright 2007, Hachette Audio. Used with permission.

The opening and ending music is “Jade” by Esther Nicholson and is used under license.  The editing was done by Rich Lyons of the “Living After Faith” podcast.  

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#017: End-of-the-World Blues in Lars von Trier’s “Melancholia” (feat. Niels Nothdurft)

July 9, 2018

This week’s episode is a review/analysis of Melancholia, a 2011 film written and directed by the controversial Danish filmmaker Lars von Trier. My guest for this discussion is my Danish friend and fellow Von Trier enthusiast Niels Böge Nothdurft. 

We discuss Melancholia as an apocalyptic end-of-the-world movie in both a physical and a psychological sense. The movie follows the lives of two sisters, Justine and Claire, living in the final days and hours of planet Earth as it faces imminent collision with a giant rogue planet, dubbed “Melancholia,” that has emerged from behind the sun. Melancholia is also the name given in the psychological literature of a form of severe and debilitating depression, a condition suffered by the character of Justine (played by Kirsten Dunst), who unlike her sister Claire (Charlotte Gainsbourg) experiences a sense of newfound liberation and peace from her depression as the end of the world approaches. Claire, on the other hand, is suddenly and for the first time in her luxurious and controlled life confronted by the extreme discomfort of existential angst. We discuss the movie’s use of symbolism, both medieval and modern, and as an allegory for depression, ennui, and existential angst. We also ask the question the movie invites all viewers to ask: How would we react to the knowledge that all life on earth, along with the planet itself, was going to end abruptly? Do we see ourselves in the reactions of the characters, and if so, why? 

 

Links:

Niels Nothdurft’s blog on the Trolling with Logic website: http://www.trollingwithlogic.com/euro-skeptic/ 

Lars von Trier’s “Melancholia” official website: http://www.melancholiathemovie.com/ 

“Melancholia” on IMDb: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1527186/ 

Tim Matts and Aidan Tynan, “The Melancholy of Extinction: Lars von Trier’s ‘Melancholia’ as an Environmental Film,” M/C Journal 15, no. 2 (2012), http://www.journal.media-culture.org.au/index.php/mcjournal/article/view/491

Sigmund Freud, “Mourning and Melancholia” (1917): http://www.columbia.edu/itc/hs/medical/clerkships/psych/misc/articles/freud.pdf

 

Join the official discussion group of this podcast at www.facebook.com/groups/aleapofdoubt.  

Consider supporting me Patreon if you enjoy the show: http://www.patreon.com/aleapofdoubt. Thanks to Jeff Prebeg, Jeanne Ikerd, Torsten Pihl, Chris Watson, and Kim Bojkovsky for being my patrons!

Follow me on Twitter at https://twitter.com/TheNatheist

The opening clip is an excerpt from the audiobook “God is Not Great” by Christopher Hitchens, courtesy of Hachette Audio. Text Copyright 2007 by Christopher Hitchens. Audio production copyright 2007, Hachette Audio. Used with permission.

The opening and ending music is “Jade” by Esther Nicholson and is used under license.  The editing was done by Rich Lyons of the “Living After Faith” podcast.  

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#016: Chris Shelton, Ex-Scientologist (Part II)

July 2, 2018

This is the second part of my interview with ex-Scientologist Chris Shelton, who for 27 years was a devout believer in and staff member of the Church of Scientology. Founded by science-fiction pulp writer L. Ron Hubbard in the mid-twentieth century, this enigmatic and powerful cult belief system has consumed and destroyed the lives of countless number of gullible people who have been drawn in by Scientology’s promises of peak mental health and mastery over life. 

Chris left Scientology behind him for good in 2013 and has been an outspoken critic of Scientology and an anti-cult activist ever since. In Part II, Chris and I continue discussing the inception in L Ron Hubbard’s unpublished works, especially the manuscript known as “Excalibur,” of what would eventually grow into the Church of Scientology. We also talk about why Scientologists believe they are saving the world and the cosmological beliefs Scientology espouses at the highest levels of membership, including of course the story of Xenu the Galactic Overlord. We touch on how we should go about defining a destructive cult, whether Scientology can accurately be called a religion, and finally address the question of what it will take for Scientology to finally takes it place in the graveyard of past spiritual movements. 

 

Links:

Chris Shelton’s website: http://mncriticalthinking.com/ 

The Sensibly Speaking Podcast: http://sensiblyspeaking.com/ 

Chris Shelton on Twitter: https://twitter.com/sheltondesigner

Chris Shelton’s YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCF326xyA0QHI7Z5xAwKQDJg

Chris Shelton’s book: https://tinyurl.com/ya5zxlaj 

 

Join the official discussion group of this podcast at www.facebook.com/groups/aleapofdoubt

Consider supporting me Patreon if you enjoy the show: http://www.patreon.com/aleapofdoubt. Thanks to Jeff Prebeg, Jeanne Ikerd, Torsten Pihl, and Chris Watson for being my patrons!

Follow me on Twitter at https://twitter.com/TheNatheist

The opening clip is an excerpt from the audiobook “God is Not Great” by Christopher Hitchens, courtesy of Hachette Audio. Text Copyright 2007 by Christopher Hitchens. Audio production copyright 2007, Hachette Audio. Used with permission.

The opening and ending music is “Jade” by Esther Nicholson and is used under license.

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#015: Chris Shelton, Ex-Scientologist (Part I)

June 25, 2018

My guest this week is author and podcaster Chris Shelton, who for 27 years was a devout believer in and staff member of the Church of Scientology. Founded by science-fiction pulp writer L. Ron Hubbard in the mid-twentieth century, this enigmatic and powerful cult belief system has consumed and destroyed the lives of countless number of gullible people who have been drawn in by Scientology’s promises of peak mental health and mastery over life.

Chris left Scientology behind him for good in 2013 and has been an outspoken critic of Scientology and an anti-cult activist ever since. We discuss his personal journey into and out of Scientology, what Scientology really is in contrast to what it presents itself as being to the world, and the history of L. Ron Hubbard and the influences that inspired his creation of the pseudoscience known as Dianetics and ultimately of Scientology. This episode is Part I of a discussion that continues next week in Part II.

Links:

My appearance on the Hertzey Talks show: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJAsrj32aZo

Chris Shelton’s website: http://mncriticalthinking.com/

The Sensibly Speaking Podcast: http://sensiblyspeaking.com/

Chris Shelton on Twitter: https://twitter.com/sheltondesigner

Chris Shelton’s YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCF326xyA0QHI7Z5xAwKQDJg

Chris Shelton’s book: https://tinyurl.com/ya5zxlaj

 

Join the official discussion group of this podcast at www.facebook.com/groups/aleapofdoubt.

Consider supporting me Patreon if you enjoy the show: http://www.patreon.com/aleapofdoubt. Thanks to Jeff Prebeg, Jeanne Ikerd, Torsten Pihl, and Chris Watson for being my patrons!

Follow me on Twitter at https://twitter.com/TheNatheist.

The opening clip is an excerpt from the audiobook “God is Not Great” by Christopher Hitchens, courtesy of Hachette Audio. Text Copyright 2007 by Christopher Hitchens. Audio production copyright 2007, Hachette Audio. Used with permission.

The opening and ending music is “Jade” by Esther Nicholson and is used under license.

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#014: Cultural Narratives, Political Tribes, & Humanity’s Death Star (feat. Dr. Valerie Tarico)

June 19, 2018

My guest for this episode is Dr. Valerie Tarico, a psychologist, writer, and social commentator who tackles religious fundamentalism, gender roles, reproductive empowerment, and the intersection of these three. She joins me on this episode to discuss the power of political mythmaking and cultural storytelling and try to understand the confusing and often frustrating dynamics that we’re currently witnessing in much progressive discourse (or in some cases, debacles). 

Dr. Tarico has identified three main narratives that dominate the cultural and political marketplace of ideas. We talk about what these stories are, and the ways in which humans relate and receive these narratives to and from our fellow tribe members in order to effect desired social change. We also discuss what progressives might do differently moving forward to take control of our cultural evolution and effect desired social change in positive directions that challenge old ways of thought and action that threaten our continued existence. Can the Enlightenment liberal vision be reconciled with the post-structuralist and postmodern liberal visions, and if so, how? How do we go about mending the rifts in the secular humanist community and move forward to make real change? And what the hell do Black Panther and Wonder Woman have to do with “sophisticated” theologians? 

My appearance on Minnesota Atheists Talk Radio Show: https://player.fm/series/atheists-talk-radio-show/ep-455-religious-apocalypse-in-cinema

This week’s shout-outs:
Jerb the Humanist (https://tinyurl.com/ydc9rrl6)
The Podunk Polymath Podcast (https://tinyurl.com/yc7voypf

 

Links:

Dr. Valerie Tarico’s website: https://valerietarico.com/

On Twitter: https://twitter.com/ValerieTarico

Valerie Tarico’s YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/TrustingDoubt

Valerie Tarico, “Political Narrative I: This Simple Idea is the Reactor at the Heart of Humanity’s Death Star,” March 14, 2018, https://tinyurl.com/ydz86m5b.

Valerie Tarico, “Political Narrative II: Why Some Progressives Are Tearing Each Other Apart,” March 30, 2018, https://tinyurl.com/y9um2gy3 

Amy Chua, “Revenge of the Tribes: How the American Empire Could Fall,” Big Think, February 28, 2018, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LZ71c9VVn0.

 

Join the official discussion group of this podcast at facebook.com/groups/aleapofdoubt 

Consider supporting me Patreon if you enjoy the show: http://www.patreon.com/aleapofdoubt. Thanks to Jeff Prebeg, Jeanne Ikerd, Torsten Pihl, and Chris Watson for being my patrons!

Follow me on Twitter at https://twitter.com/TheNatheist

The opening clip is an excerpt from the audiobook “God is Not Great” by Christopher Hitchens, courtesy of Hachette Audio. Text Copyright 2007 by Christopher Hitchens. Audio production copyright 2007, Hachette Audio. Used with permission.

The opening and ending music is “Jade” by Esther Nicholson and is used under license.

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#013: Passionate Atheism (feat. Sally Hunt)

June 12, 2018

On this episode, I speak with Sally Hunt, atheist activist and author of the blog and YouTube channel The Passionate Atheist. According to her website, she “advocates for the separation of church & state, comprehensive sex education, sex-positivity, feminism, social, racial, & economic justice, and equal human rights for all.” She is the Public Relations Director of The Original Motto Project, which seeks to replace the divisive and discriminatory U.S. motto, “In God We Trust,” with the original – and rightful – U.S. motto, “E Pluribus Unum,” (meaning “From many, one”) or the first three words of the U.S. Constitution, “We the People.”

Sally and I discuss her public, peaceful opposition to the huge “In God We Trust” display emblazoned in the town hall meeting room of the Board of Aldermen in Wentzville, Missouri, and of her experience being cut off and kicked out of the meeting. We discuss her appearance on Fox News’ show “The Ingraham Angle” following that event, where she faced off with Ingraham and MO State Senator Bob Onder. We also talk about the failure of abstinence-only sex education and Sally’s campaign against Thrive’s “Best Choice” program, a curriculum written by Christians with an agenda to insert religious doctrine concerning sex into public school classrooms. 

Links: 

Sally Hunt’s website and blog: http://thepassionateatheist.com/author/sallyhunt/

Sally Hunt YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/sallymander44 

Sally Hunt on Twitter: https://twitter.com/sallybhunt

On Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/passionateatheist

Expose Thrive website: https://www.exposethrive.com/

Hemant Mehta, “Atheist Kicked Out of MO Town Meeting After Criticizing ‘In God We Trust’ Sign,” Friendly Atheist, February 16, 2018, https://tinyurl.com/y7jlmchl

The Original Motto Project’s video of Sally Hunt speaking at the Wentzville, MO council meeting opposing “In God We Trust”: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=la7TJKVSwsM 

Sally’s appearance on Fox News’ “The Ingraham Angle”: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uzunZpw-jv4 

Sally’s commentary and analysis on her Fox News appearance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYpfG506JmY 

 

Join the official discussion group of this podcast at www.facebook.com/groups/aleapofdoubt/ 

Consider supporting me Patreon if you enjoy the show: http://www.patreon.com/aleapofdoubt. Thanks to Jeff Prebeg, Jeanne Ikerd, Torsten Pihl, and Chris Watson for being my patrons!

Follow me on Twitter at https://twitter.com/TheNatheist 

The opening clip is an excerpt from the audiobook “God is Not Great” by Christopher Hitchens, courtesy of Hachette Audio. Text Copyright 2007 by Christopher Hitchens. Audio production copyright 2007, Hachette Audio. Used with permission.

The opening and ending music is “Jade” by Esther Nicholson and is used under license. The editing was done by Rich Lyons of the “Living After Faith” podcast. 

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#012: Robert G. Ingersoll and the Golden Age of Freethought (feat. Justin Clark)

June 6, 2018

In this episode, we are diving into the history of the American freethought movement, specifically the “Golden Age of Freethought” from the late nineteenth-century to the beginning of WWI. The orator, essayist, and freethinker Robert Green Ingersoll (1833-1899), who was widely known as the “Great Agnostic,” was a key figure during this period, and so we talk about his life and work at length. My guest for this episode is Justin Clark. A public and intellectual historian and graduate of Indiana University, Justin wrote a Master’s thesis on the life and work of Ingersoll and is the co-founder of ReasonRevolution.org, a website about secular humanism, atheism, skepticism, and free thought.

In our discussion, Justin and I covered a lot of ground, including: what differences and similarities exist between the Golden Age of Freethought in the American Midwest and the Enlightenment Deism of eighteenth-century American politics? In what sense can Ingersoll be considered a public intellectual of his time? How and why did the freethought movement in America fall apart by the turn of the twentieth century? Are we living in another Golden Age (or Silver Age) of Freethought in America today? We also tackle the importance and under-appreciation of synthesis and popularization of intellectual endeavors for the benefit of all members of the public.

Links:

Reason Revolution website: https://reasonrevolution.org/

Reason Revolution on Twitter: https://twitter.com/ReasonOrg

Reason Revolution on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/reasonrevolution

Reason Revolution on YouTube: https://tinyurl.com/ydc8fhe4

Robert Green Ingersoll (1833-1899): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_G._Ingersoll

 

Join the official discussion group of this podcast at https://www.facebook.com/groups/alopdiscussion/

Consider supporting me Patreon if you enjoy the show: http://www.patreon.com/aleapofdoubt. Thanks to Jeff Prebeg, Jeanne Ikerd, Torsten Pihl, and Chris Watson for being my patrons!

Follow me on Twitter at https://twitter.com/TheNatheist

The opening clip is an excerpt from the audiobook “God is Not Great” by Christopher Hitchens, courtesy of Hachette Audio. Text Copyright 2007 by Christopher Hitchens. Audio production copyright 2007, Hachette Audio. Used with permission.

The opening and ending music is “Jade” by Esther Nicholson and is used under license.

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#011: From Religious Cult Member to Atheist Activist (feat. Joe Magestro)

May 23, 2018

In this episode, I dive into the topic of religious exclusivity and cult-like doctrines. My special guest is Joseph Magestro, author of the book Ask an Atheist: What You Should Know When Discussing God and Religion. In this book, Joe describes himself as “just an average person – your average atheist” who enjoys “discussing religion with numerous individuals and being a resource for anyone who wishes to open their mind to something new.” But Joe’s backstory is not so average, and he has a fascinating personal story to tell. When Joe was a Christian believer, he was involved in Iglesia ni Cristo (or “Church of Christ”), a fundamentalist, cult-like Christian church whose members claim to be exclusively the only true Christians. The church has a small presence in the US and elsewhere, but they are historically and currently based in the Philippines, where it was founded in 1914 by Felix Malano. 

In my discussion with Joe on this episode, we discuss what life is like inside the church, how he became involved with it initially, some of the scandals and controversies that have put the church in the news, and what chain of events and thought processes led him to abandon the church and abandon religious belief altogether to become the atheist activist he is today. 

Links:

Joe Magestro’s book “Ask an Atheist: What You Should Know When Discussing God & Religion”: https://tinyurl.com/yacc94f5

Milwaukee Humanists on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MKEHumanists/ 

Joe Magestro on the “Real Life Beyond Faith” podcast: https://reallifebeyondfaith.podbean.com/e/ep-25-joe-magestro-ex-cult-member/

Robert R. Reed, “The Iglesia ni Cristo, 1914-2000: From Obscure Philippine Faith to Global Belief System,” Bijdragen tot de Taal-, Land- en Volkenkunde (Journal of the Humanities and Social Sciences of Southeast Asia and Oceania) 157, no. 3 (2001): 561-608. https://tinyurl.com/yd6h8n3t

Eric Rankin, “Philippines-based church has ‘means and motivation’ to kill refugee if returned: IRB,” CBC News, January 25, 2018,  http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/refugee-philippines-church-lowell-menorca-1.4502614

ABS-CBN News, “Timeline: Iglesia ni Cristo in Crisis,” http://news.abs-cbn.com/nation/08/28/15/timeline-iglesia-ni-cristo-crisis.

INC Kids’ music video “Always Submit to the Church Administration,” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nmYOQIidqo  

 

Join the official discussion group of this podcast at https://www.facebook.com/groups/alopdiscussion/

Consider supporting me Patreon if you enjoy the show: patreon.com/aleapofdoubt. Thanks to Jeff Prebeg, Jeanne Ikerd, Torsten Pihl, and Chris Watson for being my patrons!

Follow me on Twitter at https://twitter.com/TheNatheist

The opening clip is an excerpt from the audiobook “God is Not Great” by Christopher Hitchens, courtesy of Hachette Audio. Text Copyright 2007 by Christopher Hitchens. Audio production copyright 2007, Hachette Audio. Used with permission.

The opening and ending music is “Jade” by Esther Nicholson and is used under license.

 
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#010: The Art and Social Politics of Marvel’s “Black Panther” (feat. Tony Reaves, Jr.)

April 25, 2018

In February 2018, the record-breaking film Black Panther joined the ever-growing pantheon of the Marvel Cinematic Universe and made an indelible impact on popular culture almost overnight, grossing over $1.3 billion worldwide. The movie, based on the Marvel comics created in 1966, chronicles the rise of T’Challa, the titular “Black Panther,” as the new king of the fictional and technologically-advanced hidden African kingdom of Wakanda. A stunningly rendered and beautifully-written story, Black Panther is an important and groundbreaking film with lots of potential for cultural and social consciousness-raising.

In this episode, I talk about the impact and potential of this movie with my friend and special guest, Tony Reaves, Jr. We discuss the art, politics, and social issues raised in the movie, and the moral dilemmas and questions faced by the characters within the story and how they might apply in the real world, and what makes its huge success an historic moment in film history for black identity in America and elsewhere. We also touch on the uphill battle experienced by black filmmakers in Hollywood.

Links:

Black Panther on IMDb: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1825683/

Kara Brown, “Matt Damon Interrupts Successful Black Woman Filmmaker to Explain Diversity to Her,” Jezebel, September 14, 2015, https://jezebel.com/matt-damon-interrupts-successful-black-woman-filmmaker-1730553152.

 

Join the official discussion group of this podcast at https://www.facebook.com/groups/alopdiscussion/

Consider supporting me Patreon if you enjoy the show: www.patreon.com/aleapofdoubt. Thanks to Jeff Prebeg, Jeanne Ikerd, Torsten Pihl, and Chris Watson for being my patrons!

Follow me on Twitter at https://twitter.com/TheNatheist

The opening clip is an excerpt from the audiobook “God is Not Great” by Christopher Hitchens, courtesy of Hachette Audio. Text Copyright 2007 by Christopher Hitchens. Audio production copyright 2007, Hachette Audio. Used with permission.

The opening and ending music is “Jade” by Esther Nicholson and is used under license.

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#009: Naked Mormon History (feat. Bryce Blankenagel)

April 18, 2018

In this episode, we return to the subject of the weird and fascinating world of Mormonism. My guest for this episode is ex-Mormon Bryce Blankenagel, who joins me to dive even deeper into the history of the Mormon religion and its founder, nineteenth-century con man Joseph Smith. Bryce hosts the Naked Mormonism podcast, a historical podcast in which he brings his skills as a researcher to a chronological exploration of just how fascinating and convoluted Mormon history and doctrine really is.

We discuss his transition out of Mormonism and into atheism, what inspired him to create a serial podcast that provides a critical history of Mormonism without the rose-tinted glasses of official church accounts, and some of the highlights of what his critical research has uncovered about Mormonism’s history and key players.

Links:

Naked Mormonism podcast: http://www.nakedmormonismpodcast.com/index.html

Naked Mormonism on Twitter: https://twitter.com/NakedMormonism

Join the official discussion group of this podcast at https://www.facebook.com/groups/alopdiscussion/

Consider supporting me Patreon if you enjoy the show: www.patreon.com/aleapofdoubt. Thanks to Jeff Prebeg, Jeanne Ikerd, and Torsten Pihl for being my patrons!

Follow me on Twitter at https://twitter.com/TheNatheist

The opening clip is an excerpt from the audiobook “God is Not Great” by Christopher Hitchens, courtesy of Hachette Audio. Text Copyright 2007 by Christopher Hitchens. Audio production copyright 2007, Hachette Audio. Used with permission.

The opening and ending music is “Jade” by Esther Nicholson and is used under license.

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